The Daily Beast takes on the Men’s Rights movement — and takes down A Voice for Men’s John Hembling

John Hembling, possibly lying about something

John Hembling, possibly lying about something

The bad publicity bonanza for Men’s Rights activists continues — and it couldn’t happen to a worse group of people.

Yesterday, the Daily Beast published a long-awaited piece on the Men’s Rights movement, and it’s a doozy. If you’re a regular reader of this site, trust me, you’ll want to read the whole thing, like now. The piece, by R. Tod Kelly, is long — some 6000 words — but worth it.

It’s mostly on the money, but with a few notable flaws.

Here’s what it gets right:

1) It captures the pervasive misogyny of the Men’s Rights movement in general, and of A Voice for Men in particular.

2) In an extended section, it profiles AVFM’s John Hembling, and tears apart some of his most blatant lies — including the now legendary box-cutter incident, in which Hembling claims to have stared down a mob of 20-30 feminists brandishing boxcutters.

As Kelly notes:

Vancouver police records show that there was indeed an altercation in September of 2012 between Hembling and others seeking to tear down men’s rights posters. However, according to the police, Hembling was arguing with two or three people, not being accosted by a “mob” of any size. When questioned by the authorities, neither Hembling nor witnesses mentioned seeing any weapons. …

Curiously enough, Hembling actually videotaped the events and had his AV4M Radio partner Karen Straughan post it online. The discussion with the police has been conveniently edited out, but the rest of the video clearly matches police records and not Hembling’s story. There are only a few young men taking down Hembling’s posters, and the video shows them choosing to ignore him except when he engages them in conversation. One of the men is seen using a box cutter to take down the flyers, but at no time does he use it as a weapon, raise his voice, or threaten Hembling in any way.

Kelly found some troubling, er, discrepancies in another story told by Hembling. Kelly writes:

According to Hembling, sometime around 1995 he was on his way home at 2:00 am after working a night shift when he came upon [a sexual] assault in progress. He says he used his steel-toed boots as weapons to chase off the perpetrator. When the victim was too distraught to speak with him, Hembling says he contacted the police, waited until they arrived, and then quietly left without speaking to them. He says they later tracked him down at his home, where he gave a statement.

It’s hard to know whether this event actually occurred or not. There is no record—at least, not in the Vancouver police files—of Hembling being a material witness to a rape, and police blotters from that time period do not show a crime that matches Hembling’s description. However, this does not necessarily mean the event did not occur. Vancouver police did not fully computerize their data until 2002, and it is possible the police never reported the incident. Hembling claims the incident took place at a specific hospital, where he says he worked as a contractor for 18 months. The address he gives, however, is for a different hospital in a completely different part of the city. This raises the curious question of whether Hembling forget the name of the hospital he contracted with for 18 months, or whether he forget what part of the city he worked in for that same period of time. The real truth of the matter is anyone’s guess, because Hembling wouldn’t comment to The Beast on that or any other matter.

In other words: Cool story, bro.

3) Another thing the story gets right: it makes clear just how little the Men’s Rights movement does to actually help men — and how in many ways it can actually be terribly damaging to men who need real help. As Kelly writes,

the movement’s radicals might … do … immediate damage to those who most desperately need the MRM to succeed.

“When we talk about recovery from trauma and abuse, there were two things that helped me,” says Chris Anderson, executive director of the male-victim advocacy group Male Survivor and a sexual abuse survivor himself. “The first was realizing that I’m not alone; the second was hearing that recovery was possible.” Anderson is quick to dissociate himself from the men’s rights movement: “In [the MRM] people get that first message, that they’re not alone. I don’t know that they ever get the second message. And when they don’t get that second message, it turns into an endless feedback loop and eventually they say, ‘Oh my God, all of society is f**ked.’”

Indeed, Kelly writes:

It is telling to note that of the professional male-victim advocacy organizations I spoke with, every single one specifically asked that I not allow readers to think they were in any way related to the MRM.

But there are also some things that I think the article gets wrong.

1) I think it gives Men’s Rights activists way too much credit for their supposed good intentions. While there are some MRAs who do seem to be motivated at least in part by a sincere desire to help men, most of the MRAs I’ve encountered in the 3 years of doing this blog have clearly been motivated primarily by anger and hatred of feminists — and women in general. They don’t really seem to give a shit about doing anything to actually improve the lives of men — and the paucity of their accomplishments reflects this. In its relatively brief lifespan, AVFM has raised many hundreds of thousands of dollars. Has it set up any shelters or hotlines or helplines for men? Not a one.

2) It wildly exaggerates the importance of Hembling to the MRM - especially ironic given that Hembling has been more or less AWOL in recent months, producing only a few short videos and one article for AVFM.

3) It paints a picture of The Spearhead’s WF Price as a Men’s Rights “moderate.” Really? While it’s true that Price is not an AVFM-style hothead given to rants about “fucking your shit up,” his views are anything but moderate. This is a guy who thinks higher education is wasted on women, who blames the epidemic of rape in the armed forces on women, who celebrated one Mothers Day with a vicious transphobic rant, who once used the tragic death of a woman who’d just graduated from college to argue that “after 25, women are just wasting time.” He published posts on why women’s suffrage is a bad idea. Plus, have you met his commenters?

I was, however, kind of amazed to learn that Price is married … and to a feminist. No, really.

4) The article, while solidly researched, contains some small errors and simplifications that will no doubt give MRAs and others the excuse they need to dismiss the whole thing. Kelly refers to Reddit subreddits as Reddit “threads!” He refers to Matt Forney as an MRA! Oh no!

Still, whatever its flaws, this is an important piece, and one that tells a lot of truth about the Men’s Rights movement. Again — go read it!

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Posted on October 20, 2013, in a voice for men, are these guys 12 years old?, johntheother, lying liars, misogyny, MRA and tagged , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 1,889 Comments.

  1. Freeform jazz I wouldn’t care if I never heard again! Actually most jazz leaves me cold, unless Glenn Miller counts as jazz.

    Hmm, good Renaissance music … Hesperion XX (or XXI, I’ve lost count) do a lot of good CDs. It’s years since I bought any early music CDs, though, so my knowledge isn’t exactly up to date.

    ::plugging obvious favourite:: L’Orchestre de Louis XIII shows how the music changed in the early 1600s. It’s mostly by one composer, collected by his son (or grandson, I forget) and the style really does change in the space of a decade or two from Renaissance to Baroque.

    My first exposure to the music of the time was in the 70s, watching The Six Wives of Henry VIII and Elizabeth R as a kid. The music for those was done by the Early Music Consort of London, led by David Munrow. It’s not all of the period; they did put in stuff from earlier and later in some bits, this being for TV. But it has that strong reed instrument (I think) sound that’s so Tudor for me - sackbutts and the like. Love it.

    Michael Praetorius is a much-reproduced composer, or collector, of dance music around 1600; his Terpsichore turns up everywhere.

    Two Renaissance Dance Bands by the Early Music Consort of London is another good one. I don’t know if it went to CD, I’ve got it on LP.

    Hoping this is the right piece: Bouree d’Avignonez, 1615, by Philidor the Elder

  2. gillyrosebee - well done well done well done!

    /Neddy Seagoon moment

  3. And, because McGee will not bother to read elsewhere:

    The burden of proof is always on the person making an assertion or proposition. Shifting the burden of proof, a special case of argumentum ad ignorantium, is the fallacy of putting the burden of proof on the person who denies or questions the assertion being made. The source of the fallacy is the assumption that something is true unless proven otherwise.

    The person making a negative claim cannot logically prove nonexistence. And here’s why: to know that a X does not exist would require a perfect knowledge of all things (omniscience). To attain this knowledge would require simultaneous access to all parts of the world and beyond (omnipresence). Therefore, to be certain of the claim that X does not exist one would have to possess abilities that are non-existent. Obviously, mankind’s limited nature precludes these special abilities. The claim that X does not exist is therefore unjustifiable. As logician Mortimer Adler has pointed out, the attempt to prove a universal negative is a self- defeating proposition. These claims are “worldwide existential negatives.” They are only a small class of all possible negatives. They cannot be established by direct observation because no single human observer can cover the whole earth at one time in order to declare by personal authority that any “X” doesn’t exist.

    Some more on the forming of propositions, and the proof of negative claims:

    It is possible to prove rather specific negative claims that are made with rather well defined limits. If the area to be searched is well defined and of a reasonable size that permits searching then a negative claim might be capable of being proven. For example, if one claims that there is no apple in the top desk drawer of a desk then all one needs to do is to open the top desk drawer indicated in the claim and examine it for its contents. Finding no apple therein would provide sufficient evidence under ordinary circumstances to verify or confirm the negative claim that there is no apple in the top desk drawer.
    In this regard Irving Marmer Copi writes:
    “ “In some circumstances it can be safely assumed that if a certain event had occurred, evidence of it could be discovered by qualified investigators. In such circumstances it is perfectly reasonable to take the absence of proof of its occurrence as positive proof of its non-occurrence.” - Introduction to Logic, Copi, 1953, Page 95

    You can prove a specific negative claim by providing contradictory evidence. An example of a proof of a rather specific negative claim by contradictory evidence would be if someone were to claim that the one and only watch that you own is in the top drawer of the desk. You make the negative claim that it is not in the drawer and you see it clearly on your wrist. There is no need to look in the drawer.

    You can also prove specific negative claims that can be rephrased as a positive claim. If someone claims that the lights are not on in room 442 that claim can be rephrased as claiming that the lights are off in room 442.

    So, as this shows, Denial Boy still has the burden of proof.

  4. a double-blind survey of one or several rape victims

    Laughing my ass off over here on how this sack of human waste thinks it’s possible to do a double-blind survey of a single person. Also related: His apparent complete lack of understanding of the importance of sample size in attaining useful data.

    At any rate, I think I’ll leave off the yelling for a bit in favor of just laughing at how bullshit this is, since SOMEONE’S too much of a sad cowardly misuse of carbon to answer simple questions, and I’ve got a husband to canoodle with, some tasty Italian food (cooked by said husband) to enjoy, and a full day of making sad faces at Sears customer service people, putting the finishing touches on my Florentine gown, and meeting up with friends for Szechuan food tomorrow. I just can’t muster the necessary rage atmo.

    Anyways, here’s a cute penguin! :D

  5. *yawn* Can we discuss cookie butter?

    Nah, I’m gonna talk about it anyways. Had my first spoonful of cookie butter today. It tastes like gingersnaps! So nommy with a glass and a half of milk. Mmmm.

  6. Also, Asshole McGee, I see that your degree from the University of Google’s showing. You can’t double blind a rape victim into thinking that their rape never happened.

  7. Alice! I must know more about this “cookie butter” of which you speak! Tell me all!

    No, really, that sounds hella tasty but I don’t know what it is or how to acquire it.

  8. I’ve got a husband to canoodle with, some tasty Italian food (cooked by said husband) to enjoy,

    Noodles and canoodles! Enjoy! :)

  9. You can’t double blind a rape victim into thinking that their rape never happened.

    Bet he wishes he could.

  10. Time to pack, off to a science fiction folk music convention tomorrow.

  11. What pecunium quoted, in little words the hostile one may understand -

    You can’t prove that not one single person has been helped by the concept of rape culture. That would require knowledge of every last person on earth and is thus impossible. You can, however, disprove the theory that it has helped no one by demonstrating that it has helped someone.

    Which we have done. Repeatedly.

  12. dustydeste - Someone here on Manboobz mentioned cookie butter, and told me that it was just basically peanut butter but with cookies. So I went to Trader Joes and bought a jar.

    I just ate a heaping spoonful. NOMMMMSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.

  13. Have fun, and stay remotely in touch with me? My brain is all messy.

  14. kittehs - You know, every time I see a rape apologist somewhere on the Internet, I’m often left to wonder whether these rape apologists have, well, raped somebody.

    ESPECIALLY if they ask “how drunk is too drunk to consent?”. Then it’s red flags for me.

  15. Alice - that’s exactly how I see it (don’t know if you saw what baileyrenee and I were saying upthread). Rape apologists, especially male ones, pretty much equate to uncaught rapists, to me.

  16. Alice: Mmmmm, I will have to look for this confection when I’m near a Trader Joe’s!

    Kittehs: No noodles tonight, actually! Probably for lunch, though. We eat a tremendous amount of pasta. More than when I was at uni, which I didn’t think was really possible, haha.

    Pecunium: You’re going filking?! I’m jealous!

  17. Either un caught or would-be rapists. Some are surely trying to clarify what they could get away with.

  18. deste - I was making a loose connection, pasta and noodles being much of a muchness to me. The rhyme was too much of an opportunity to miss. :D

    Argenti - good point, wannabes as well as not caught yet.

  19. @Kitteh, I do like that music! It’s not the sort of music I’d put on my ipod for pacing purposes (I prefer this sort of music for that:

    … I walk fast. I use this kind if I want to take my time:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgNqL2aTAYY )
    but definitely evening music.

  20. deste – I was making a loose connection, pasta and noodles being much of a muchness to me. The rhyme was too much of an opportunity to miss. :D

    Mm… I used to think that, but then I tried to cook vermicelli as one would noodles… dark days.

  21. Yeah, not all noodles are pasta, and not all pasta is noodles (now, the real question is, why is pasta a singular noun?)

  22. Deste: yeppers, off to OVFF

    Where I will see old friends, sing some (though I never take my turn in circle, save to; perhaps, do some pennywhistle), meet some people I don’t know yet, and generally have a good time.

    (yes, Argenti I will not not drop completely from the face of the earth).

  23. Because it doesn’t mean noodles, it means paste/dough.

  24. Soon as I see the word vermicelli, I’m transported back to Young Frankenstein …

    Medical Student: Isn’t it true that Darwin preserved a piece of vermicelli in a glass case until, by some extrordinary means, it actually began to move with voluntary motion?

    Dr. Frederick Frankenstein: Are you speaking of the worm or the spaghetti?

    I’m glad you like that piece! It’s one of my favourites from the album; it’s supposed to have been written for Louis’s wedding celebrations.

    There are some really bouncy medieval pieces, too. St George’s Canzona did an album called Medieval Songs and Dances (that’s the album’s later name). Some of it’s a bit, hmm (Robin Hood and the Tanner is one weird song - friend of mine called it a gay men’s bonding ritual song) but some of it’s great:

  25. Oh, I wasn’t trying too be pedantic about the noodles/pasta thing (though Dr. Husbutt would be! He takes his pasta very seriously… and I laugh at him for it); I meant more that we weren’t have pasta/noodles at all for dinner! We feasted on polpette tonight :D

  26. I haven’t caught up with this thread yet, but I’m putting hostile on moderation for his creepy rape joke thing.

  27. dustydeste, I knew it! I knew it wouldn’t be pasta and my joke would be ROONED!

    David, thank you.

  28. Ah, music! A much better topic of discussion!!

    I have a fairly broad musical taste, but Baroque was never really for me. Bach, of course, Corelli and Vivaldi of course. Maybe Carpentier and Monteverdi. But not much else really.

    Shift a bit earlier, however, and you’ve got Palestrina

    sigh…

    A bit earlier still and there is Guillaume de Machaut

  29. So sick of this ableist shit!

    I know the person on the Vox thread probably didn’t mean to be an arse and kitteh set them straight, so I don’t want to pile in, but fucking hell!

    I’m really fucking struggling with my OCD tonight and I haven’t fucking slept in days, yes I probably am a little bit fucking mad!

    But why the fuck would that mean I don’t have sense and decency?

    I am a good person, I have never hurt anybody! I also happen to have a very high IQ!

    Insane does NOT equal stupid MRA shithead!

    MRAs are shits, that is all.

    Sorry, I know everyone’s probably gone, but just had to rage, you know what us insane people are like, no sense and decency!

    Fuck.

  30. Later, of course, you have an embarrassment of riches: Mozart, Gluck, Hayden, Clementi and Boccherini. Boccherini is one of my favorites; a little mannered, a little saccharine at times, but lovely.

    And hooray for shunting the tedious trollio onto moderation!

  31. Sorry, shouldn’t have said the IQ bit, seems like showing off, in a bit of a rage.
    Now I’m gonna crawl away and die, I’m such an arse!

  32. Hugs if you want them, ophelia <3

  33. No, Ophelia, you are not a good person. You are a wonderful person; witty and interesting, and often displaying great compassion and empathy.

    My profound sympathy, and empathy as well, as I’ve been averaging two to three hours a night. All the hugs if you want them.

  34. ophelia, you are NOT an arse, you do NOT need to crawl away and you did NOT sound like you were showing off - given how often ableist slurs are used to say not only that someone’s bad, but that they’re stupid, it’s relevant.

    Want some kitty hugs? Or hugs from someone with a guaranteed-snot-free ‘tache?

  35. Not *just* a good person, I suppose I should have written there.

    I look forward to reading your comments, anyway.

  36. If you are looking for a good hiding place, I think this kitty knows the best ones

  37. Or even better, a highly dangerous shark cat!

  38. OMG those legs sticking out of the couch! :D

  39. You’re all so lovely.

    I’m just so tired and a bit pissed, thought the alcohol might make me sleep, but it’s not fucking working!
    15, 15, 15 have to do everything fucking 15 fucking times, so fucking sick of it!

  40. Ophelia, hugs if you want them. Want a free virtual spoon of cookie butter? I have an entire jar full of the stuff!

    dustydeste - It is NOMMY. Get some milk too, then it’s like you’re eating milk and cookies, except no crumbs! :P

  41. Also, I’m a bit too English to know what to do with compliments, please don’t think I’m ignoring them though, just kind of shy.

  42. Put ‘em in your compliments jar for when you want them later! :)

  43. Well, Ophelia, I have exactly 15 hugs for you then. Because you are still an awesome person, just one who does everything 15 times.

    “(yes, Argenti I will not not drop completely from the face of the earth).”

    Thank you my dearest mango hater :)

    Also, all hail the Dark Lord!

  44. Lack of sleep can indeed make it hard to get things done. So can having cats.

  45. Food, foods another thing.
    Nobody tells you OCD will fuck with that either!
    I am so fucking hungry, but oh nooooooo, OCD says no food for 15 hours or something terrible I’ll happen to Mr M!

    Sorry, will stop inflicting my insanity now.

  46. Loophole yourself a snack? Or a beverage that’s got nutrional value? (Sorry if this is unwanted advice)

  47. And you aren’t inflicting your insanity, we care, therefore you are welcome to continue!

  48. Now if rotten OCD could be fooled into accepting it’s fifteen seconds, or fifteen minutes …

    Seconding Argenti here! I wish I had something useful to suggest.

  49. Okay, 3pm here, must dash! Hugs to all!

  50. Oh gods I just saw the comment that caused you to start this topic and ARRRRRGGGGHHHH

    I have no common sense or decency? This is news to me. I mean, I did sorta just moon my mother, but she started it with “you’re flashing me” (with my iPad screen, in the dark) so I had a “no, now I’m flashing you” retort.

    Pretty sure that wasn’t the sort of decency I supposedly lack though…

    Why do they always…ARGGHHH

    Ophelia, the lack of sleep problem, seroquel is my wonder drug for that one, anti-psychotic technically, but at MUCH lower doses it works as a sleeping pill. And being the class it is, you should be able to ask about it without ringing the “drug seeker” alarm.

    Oh and bipolar, PTSD, and generalized anxiety disorder here btw. Another one you may want to ask about, if you aren’t thinking “just shut up already Argenti”, is prazosin. Idk if you’ve seen me mention my anti-PTSD-nightmare drug, but that’s it. (Also off label with little risk of abuse so asking shouldn’t raise alarms)

  51. Hugs back! For anyone who needs one. In fact, I’m once again dragging out the big barrel o’ hugs and non-contact comforting gestures, to be distributed by guinea pigs, kittens, or penguins wearing Spanx as you wish. I’m just going to leave it here in the center of the room.

  52. Sorry, didn’t mean to make anyone feel like they had to help. I’m fucked, I accept it. Just have to drink so much I don’t notice. :)

    After reading everything back so many times I realised. I swear A LOT!

    Foul mouthed feminist that I am. :)
    Must have learnt it from Mrs Doyle, ah feck…

  53. @argenti, sorry not ignoring you, it’s just if I type a comment it takes me ages to read it so many times.

    I have PTSD too, full on fucking hallucinations quite recently! Sorry if I’ve upset you by bringing this up.

    I’m going to see a new psych in a couple of weeks who specialises in PTSD, it’s a new research program at the local Uni, but to be honest nothing seems to help.

    TMI time, Regarding sleeping meds, I took a couple of boxes of them a while ago, so now they won’t prescribe.

    So gin it is, god I hate gin! We’re boycotting vodka because of the homophobia thing, so bloody gin!

    Incidentally, my keyboard is now not working on my iPad, and it just told me there’s a new update, bloody sodding iOS 7!

  54. Stoli is not made in Russia, it’s made in Latvia.

    Me, I hate tequila, and don’t do Southern Comfort, most gins, Cynar, or Ratzputz.

  55. Stoli it is then. Thank you. :)

  56. And you aren’t inflicting your insanity, we care, therefore you are welcome to continue!

    This. I’d much rather pay attention to the manboobzers than continue editing the crappy, horrible, no good piece of campaign pablum that I need to finish before I can go to bed.

    And a firm second on low dose seroquel.

    Meanwhile, bourbon is nice, and there are plenty of small batch artisanal versions out there so that you can support small craft makers (I’m a small artisanal crafter, so it matters to me!).

    Maybe try this? You are getting sleeeeeepy. Sleeeeeeeeeeeeeeepy…

  57. @gillyrosebee, thank you, sorry, it took me a minute to stop blushing.
    I’ve been lurking forever on Man Boobz and your posts always make me stop and listen.
    I realise how hard it must be to write about this stuff, but I for one have learnt such a lot.
    I’m having trouble putting things into words today so I’m gonna shut up now. Hope it makes sense.

  58. Good luck with iOS 7, it hates me. And no worries, my hearing has me far more upset than you do (really, if anything, I’m trying to be helpful because otherwise I’m just going to be a twitchy mess…so you’re sorta helping or something?)

    [Trigger Warning, suicide, in very clinical terms]

    I just checked quick, and as I suspected my bottle of 25mg seroquel is WAY less than you could OD on. Like, max daily dose for schizophrenia is 800mg a day…not surprising it’d be impossible to OD on, maybe they were listening when I said I’d tried that last year… (obviously YMMV and whatnot) — but I could down my entire bottle on refill day and be under the daily max dose. Probably be unpleasant in the side effect department, but not fatal.

    /TW

    Like I said, it isn’t a sleeping pill. It’s an antipsychotic known for knocking people the fuck out at particularly low doses.

    In any case, good luck with new-psych!

    ——

    Booze…

    Southern Comfort is triggery six ways to Sunday, being what I was barfing when obviously too drunk to consent
    Rum is gross
    Gin, particularly sole gin…only way I’m touching that is if I’m trying to kill myself
    Whiskey, yes, please
    Vodka, hand me the bottle
    Brandy, idk? Never had it, or sherry, or tequila. I get the impression I’m not missing much on that last one.
    Wine…depends the wine, the meal, etc, usually acceptable as a beverage, but a failure at getting drunk (given how much vodka I can drink, I’d probably have to finish a bottle in like two hours…tasty all the same)
    Beer…ick. Yueng Ying Black and Tan is lovely though.
    Ouzo…no. Licorice. No. Bad icky licorice.
    Limoncello — despite don’t being too fond of lemon, yuuuummmm

  59. Ooh, hadn’t refreshed before I posted that last one, so didn’t see your 11:46 comment gillyrosebee, actually never tried bourbon, hmmm.

  60. Now it’s my turn to blush. I’m really happy if I can add a bit to the community. I enjoy reading the comments of my fellow cats/ferrets here inside this David suit, I love watching everyone set in on a new chew toy, and when things are at their worst, this is one of the few places that always helps me make it through. And things have been kinda horrible lately, so I can’t thank all of the other cats/ferrets enough for being so wonderful.

  61. Belated hugs for Ophelia!

    Also, maybe I should add a new category that will automaticalloy put someone on moderation: demanding proof of something addressed by social science even though you dismiss all social science data out of hand as unscientific.

  62. Sorry things have been horrible for you, gillyrosebee. Hugs if you want ‘em.

  63. Could persistent and dogmatic mendacity be acceptable grounds for automatic moderation? Anyone can miss a point, or misunderstand a point, but metaphorically standing there with your hands over your ears, shouting “LALALALALALA I CAN’T HEAR YOU”, a la ahostiledisneyworld is clear evidence of something…

    Thanks cloudiah. I’m coming up on the anniversary of some pretty bad stuff, and this year I’m doing all the holidays by myself. Blagh.

  64. Hugs for Ophelia, and gillyrosebee… and everyone, because I can. *goes mad with power*

    Ophelia, if you really push through the English thing and lay it on really thick with the accepting compliments, it’s a lot easier… that’s how I soften my upper lip, anyway… then I freak out in my head that I’m coming off as arrogant and self absorbed, just like every time I use “I” in a sentence because, jeez, talking about myself again, how self obsessed can a guy be!?

    I (AUGH) think we should do a science experiment between us. Is pyrokinesis a real phenomenon? Next time someone uses “crazy” to mean “bad” (and then refuses to apologise and correct zirself) we attempt to set them on fire with our minds. Whaddya think?

  65. We’ll be here over the holidays with you, gillyrosebee, if you need us.

    BTW, apparently now I run a cooking blog:
    http://artistryforfeminismandkittens.wordpress.com/2013/10/23/man-boobz-recipe-hotline-pouding-chomeur/

  66. Athywren - Set them on fire? Can’t we just focus on building the Boobinater so that we can whack someone with dead trout for being an asshole?

  67. Sloe gin isn’t gin. It’s some weird infusion of sloes and everclear.

    For me, tequila tastes like ass. Really good tequila tastes like refined ass.

    As to bourbons… love them.

    As to crafting, I have put 7 skeins of yarn in my carry on, with luck I will sell a couple; with which to buy more fiber to make more yarn… it’s twisty all the way down.

  68. So sorry I made this all about me, everyone here is awesome.

    I’ve tried so many types of pills, then read the ‘Bad Pharma’ book, so anti-depressants are right out for me.

    But, as I have this appointment with my new psych (an hour and a half!) on the 13th, might ask them about the seroquel.

    Seriously, I sleep three hours max before the nightmares wake me up, and then I start the bloody 15 obsession, then no more sleep!

    @argenti, your hearing? Are you okay?
    And thank you for checking the OD info, that really helps.

    @cloudiah, you’re lovely, obviously. :)

    @gillyrosebee, Really hope I haven’t made you feel worse by bringing this up, and I’m so sorry about the anniversary/holidays, lots of consensual hugs coming your way. x

    @david Thanks. Also, can’t we ban people who for no apparent reason claim to be German when they are so obviously a pretentious Brit?

    Sorry, couldn’t resist.

    @Athywren, Christ I get so worried if I use ‘I’ too much! And when you’ve done what I’ve done in this thread and made it the all about me show, argh! Have you seen how many times I’ve written I and me here?
    Must do penance, 15 fucking times! And if it doesn’t feel right? Back to the fucking start!

    @alice, I vote for a fire breathing Boobinator!

  69. “Could persistent and dogmatic mendacity be acceptable grounds for automatic moderation?”

    In theory it already is. Tedious is on the list.

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